In painting, mixing blue and blue colors just would create more of the same, but at San Quentin, mixing officers in blue and residents in blue created an unlikely phenomenon — a complementary pairing that led to a shared understanding.
As part of San Quentin News’ continuing “Blue and Blue” law enforcement forum series, 24 blue-wearing residents of San Quentin Rehabilitation Center met with 31 officers and associates of the San Francisco Police Department, although the officers wore their street clothes. The two groups met in the Garden Chapel to discuss rehabilitation and ways to reduce violence. The May 30 event ended as a thriving success.
“Society looks at the old penal image of the prisoner but everyone has a story. Finding out the big issues between incarcerated persons and officers would give us a way to find out and bridge the differences between us,” said Patrol Officer Alan Katz, who has worked the graveyard shift for the last eight years.
An officer who identified himself as Vinnie said he came to San Quentin not knowing what to expect. “In the limited time we had, I learned a lot about how people on the opposite side of the fence can be so similar. It was an eye opening experience and I feel glad I came here. I will tell my colleagues to experience this, too.”
“I think one big thing I enjoyed was finding out who is behind the badge, who is the actual person,” said resident Anthony Lyons.
Jamie, an officer at the SFPD’s Community Engagement Division, called the meeting “powerful and humanizing.”
The Blue and Blue forums at San Quentin have a five-year-long history. Since March 2019, the meetings have supported public safety on a level never before contemplated. In the second forum in April 2022, the concept had already garnered a reputation as transformational.
Central to the forum’s success remained the leadership of Assistant Chief David Lazar, whose take-away said, “Traumatic situations have brought you here. I am impressed with proactivity of this group. Real change happens.”
The forum began with introductions in one large circle. Residents introduced themselves with their crimes and their sentences. Introductions by the visitors followed. The circle soon broke into six small circles each with four residents and five visitors. The small circle conversations often took emotional turns.
Facilitator Ryan Pagan, a resident, said, “It’s all about perspective. If we change the way we look at each other, we change the way we treat each other. I hope we turned your perspective on us upside down and you look at us differently.”
After the small circles, the forum took a short break and reconvened in one large single circle.
San Quentin News circulation manager Richard Fernandez, the moderator of the forum, took command in the center of the circle. Fernandez said he wanted to provide “an opportunity to open the doors to residents who have not had the chance to interact with police officers and to understand their daily duties and responsibilities. I steered the forum to explore issues like biases and stereotyping.”
Moderator Fernandez turned the microphone over to residents.
San Quentin News Sports Editor Anthony Caravalho said, “Police officers are survivors of crime, too.”
Resident Ramon Fritz said, “You guys have a job to do. You bring order. Today, I can understand that I had done it all wrong. Change is possible. Thank you.”
Resident Eric Allen echoed the sentiment and said, “I have seen a big change.”
Resident Dante Jones said he found refreshing that someone goes right rather than left — or wrong.
SFPD Captain Johansen said, “It was a great experience.”
SFPD Officer Mark Powell said he found the forum really moving and thanked San Quentin for hosting the event.
An officer who identified himself as Lattimore said, “Such an experience seems hard to put into a short statement. I appreciate speaking with people in blue and I will take this with me.”
Julie Lazar, the wife of the assistant chief said, “I enjoyed myself meeting residents. I found them abrings hope, and in this world, we need hope.”
Officer Nathan Bernard said, “Not something we get to experience, so unique, such an eye opener. We think of these buildings as filled with inmates but they are really filled with stories.” Bernard said he has served in the SFPD for 17 years and would come back to the next forum.
At the end, San Quentin News Editor-in-Chief Marcus Henderson said, “You did not ‘catch’ a case: you committed a crime.” Residents in the circle named their victims.
Assistant Chief Lazar concluded the event, saying, “Have a plan. Come on back and give back. That’s the next chapter.”
